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380 No. 380 ID: eb7004
How can a narrative pass the Bechdel Test if it is told by a male narrator? Without incapacitating the narrator, having him listen into a conversation, or some other contrivance? Certainly just because a work is told from a male point of view it can't be called antifeminist.

Now, I know that the Bechdel test isn't a gauge of a works feminist leanings, but we have to acknowledge that it is one of the first things brought up when discussing wether a work is or is not inclusive. AND, failing is a black mark on a work, no matter what it includes.

Personally, as a writer I am immensely frustrated with the feminist critique of pop culture. I feel that it is something that injects itself into works that aren't about gender. I feel that it is too easy to appear antifeminist through cherry-picked examples. For instance, is a male hero (or cubicle jockey in non-genre) that battles a female villain (or maybe his boss) a triumph of the patriarchy? Can a male character desire a female character and describe her as an object of sexual attraction, or does this violate her and all women by proxy?

Harry Dresden definitely related.
>> No. 385 ID: 248bbd
1. Don't worry about it too much. Just write what you want to write first and foremost.

2.
>is a male hero that battles a female villain a triumph of the patriarchy?
No. Any feminist pop-culture critic worth his or her salt understands that an inclusive work doesn't automatically have to have women in "good" roles; it means the work includes female characters that are just as nuanced and unique as the male characters. ie: the women can be heroes and villains, likeable and unlikeable, rich and poor, ugly and attractive, etc etc etc. Your work is only non-inclusive/antifeminist/sexist if the female characters are only important relative to the male characters or only exist as stereotypes next to fleshed out male characters.

If you write a story where there is a male hero and a male villain and the only female characters in the story are the hero's love interest and maybe the villains femme fatale sidekick, you're going to fail the Bechdel Test. If you write a story where there is a male hero and a female villain, as you propose in your post, there is nothing inherently sexist or antifeminist about that work and anyone who says otherwise is reaching. Unless of course your villain is a sexist stereotype of some kind, in which case you not only fail the Bechdel Test but are also probably a lazy writer for having a major character of any gender who is a narrow stereotype..

So yeah, don't worry about it too much. If you write a story that just happens to have an all-male cast, you're not a bad person.

In conclusion: don't overthink it to appease some invisible critics. Writing to please invisible critics is never a way to go. And when you do write female characters, put the same care and attention into them as you do your male characters. Problem solved
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