Shotguns are the ideal home defense weapon. If you were to use it there would be less of a chance of you putting a hole through your neighbor's wall which would be a huge liability factor. You should not be worried about ammo capacity. Most break ins are done by individuals or pairs. At most three people. If you find yourself in a situation where you're needing mutliple magazines worth of ammo, then you're facing some serious cult like home invasion (like Charles Manson status). If you even need to take a shot you might be taking one or two shots.

And please please please do not bitch about recoil. If a 12 is too powerful for you then use a 20. And if that is still too powerful then you won't need to worry about home defense becuase you'll be too much of a fucking wimp to confront an invader.

Like he said, if you need more than a full load to defend your home, you're either fighting a battle you aren't going to win anyway, or you're a really bad shot.

Even if there are more dudes than you have shells, you'll probably be able to take out a few of them of them at least, and I'm pretty sure any survivors would fuck right off after realizing this.

>>17615

word of caution about moving to a 20 gauge to manage recoil: some 20 gauge shotguns are smaller and lighter than their 12 gauge counterparts. even with the lighter load there can be more felt recoil.

might try some of those reduced recoil buckshot loads instead.

I don't know how many shells you can fit in your magazine, but you might consider making the first one or two shells less lethal. Eliminates any risk of over penetration, more forgiving if you miss a shot, more forgiving if you make the shot and it was a mistake.

>>17630
Most police use reduced recoil buckshot IIRC.

>>17632

Think so. Does the military still issue 9 pellet 00 buck?

>>17632
Bullshit. Standard law enforcement load is 12 gauge nine-pellet 00 buckshot.

>>17657
Source?

It's hard to go wrong with a 12 gauge pump for home defense. If you're REALLY worried about recoil get something heavier with plenty of wood. I'll go against the grain here and admit that ammo capacity concerns are valid, so try and get a magazine extension. There's no sense in handicapping yourself so bring plenty of firepower. If you live in a state that allows high capacity mags, a rifle is at least as good a choice as a shotgun for HD, but they generally cost a bit more. You can pick up a good used pump shotgun for a very reasonable price at most gun stores in the country.

I would argue that slugs are pretty unnecessary for HD, buckshot is generally a better choice. 00 or 000 buckshot are excellent choices. Make sure you get plenty of practice. Take a defensive shotgun course if you can afford it, or at the very least get out the to range regularly and get comfortable with the weapon. Having the best shotgun/ammo setup in the world won't mean dick if you can't handle it effectively.

Shotguns are capable defense weapons as long as you realize that 1. Any round that will kill a person WILL penetrate through walls easily, just not quite through your whole house, and 2. The "deterrant" factor of "racking it" is poor logic.

>>17710

Shotgun:
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3.htm

Pistols and Rifle:
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot1_2.htm

>>17711
I'm hesitant to trust that or even consider its results considering they state "a .223 round".

>>17712

You're going to disregard his entire test because of his choice of words at the very end? REALLY!? More than one time he states the he is using xm-193.

You sir are fucked.

>>17712
How about you conduct your own test and see if the results differ?

>>17714
That's not the point as much as it is if you have a rifle that you're keeping in your home, you should have a purpose chosen round for it. Saying that represents "rifle penetration" is silly as he only chose one round that wasn't particularly suited for it.
http://how-i-did-it.org/drywall/results.html
The right round can make a .223 rifle an effective defense weapon with a low chance of excessive penetration.

>>17722

There are more pages to that website than just the one. See:
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot4.htm

The rest of first test was using nothing but standard ball ammunition. Why would he choose something non-standard just for the AR? Throughout the test he stated he was using xm-193 which is a pretty standard round that most everyone would have. It is also applicable to most all .223 rounds except for specialized ammo. When I was just using my AR for home defense I had Winchester 5.56 loaded into it because specialized rounds double if not triple in price. Combined with the thought that if I actually HAD to use my rifle for self-defense over-penetration would be the LEAST of my worries.

>>17722

I would also like to point out that the individual you linked to did not use specialized rounds for the handguns either. He was using standard ball ammo in a handgun and comparing it to frangible ammo in a rifle. I would think that these would skew your perception more than my original link.

He chose something standard, which is fine, but I find it irrelevant because I wouldn't use standard ball in my house. Just my $0.02. I actually thought my post said that rifles could be good defense weapons as well as rifles but I actually didn't mention rifles at all, so I'm not really sure what I'm saying at this point. Disregard me!

This is why /w/ doesn't get many posts.

"Hey, I was wondering about this because I heard this, and-"
"YOU KNOW NOTHING".

>>17728

Now I'm just confused.

>>17729

That's because you do know nothing.
ZING!
<3

sage for useless

SAGE has been used.

Why not go with bird shot?

At close range its gunna do the job and it wont go through walls like your larger game shells.

>>17870
Birdshot should not be considered for home defense. It lacks the necessary penetration to reliably stop a threat. If it won't bunch through dry wall it might not punch through a thick leather best or winter coat either.

Floating around the Internet is a video interview of some kid that was shot multiple times at point blank with bird shot. Obviously, he survived. You could make the argument that shooting him/her in the face would render the assailant blind or whatever the fuck. However, you simply will not be able to this if the adrenaline starts pumping. Center mass every time, using something that can penetrate to vital organs consistently.

There's a few shotguns out there with a 8+1 capacity. That's more than what a standard 1911 will hold. If you need more than 9 shots to stop a perp or a group of perps, you may want to reconsider your ownership of a shotgun. We aren't talking Call of Duty, bum rush the capture point type of shit here. We're talking legitimate, "I am going to break in because there should be no threat waiting to stop me". Usually when they hear you chamber rounds, they stop.
If you are that worried about low capacity/high recoil, there are also semi-auto shotguns out there and AR type shotguns (full buttstock, magazines, and all). The first one doesn't satisfy your "low capacity" argument, but the AR styled shotgun does. You can easily swap magazines.
Honestly, it all boils down to personal preference and repetitive training. If you don't train with your home defense weapons, don't expect to be able to use them adequately in a high stress environment, such as those when people break into your home.

>>17915

It cannot bear enough repeating:

Home defense weapons are a deterrent. If someone breaking into your house sees you with a weapon, they're pretty likely to leave, and quickly.

If you own a weapon, you must train with it. Train seriously, and regularly. It is far more dangerous to own it and never learn how to use it than it is to not own a gun.

No way in hell, Get the remington 870 Or mossberg 590